GT3 concerns.

  • maverick
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19 Jan 2018 17:24 - 19 Jan 2018 17:25 #10370 by maverick
maverick created the topic: GT3 concerns.

Statistically most "rock spiders" have spent some time in their lives as a church youth group leader.
Think about that.
Last Edit: 19 Jan 2018 17:25 by maverick.

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  • Miguel
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20 Jan 2018 01:57 #10371 by Miguel
Miguel replied the topic: GT3 concerns.
What's that link about?

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20 Jan 2018 08:24 #10377 by Pierre
Pierre replied the topic: GT3 concerns.
Here's the direct link and part of the text. sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/marquardt-gt3...tory-backed-entries/

BMW Motorsport Director Jens Marquardt believes the GT3 platform will no longer be sustainable if manufacturers continue to pour money into its so-called customer teams.

A number of GT3-based championships, including the Blancpain GT Series and the GT Daytona class of the IMSA WeatherTech SportsCar Championship, have seen a greater concentration of factory or works-supported operations in recent years.

The movement has pushed out a number of gentlemen drivers out of the platform, due to rising costs and the inability to compete alongside all-pro lineups with factory drivers, despite some series, such as the WeatherTech Championship, being Pro-Am enforced.

Marquardt has warned of the platform’s eventual collapse, should manufacturer support eventually end.


An interesting tweet on the same topic from Mike Hedlund:


Little known facts: current PWC GTS GT4 budgets are close to what GT3 budgets were in 2014. Current PWC GT GT3 budgets are nearly 2x what they were in 2014. Current PWC GT budget is more than complete Rolex GT season budget in 2013 (including Daytona 24). #unsustainable

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20 Jan 2018 10:01 #10382 by velly4
velly4 replied the topic: GT3 concerns.
Things are definitely starting to look sketchy. Need some sort of cost cap not only on purchase of cars but parts also

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20 Jan 2018 23:04 #10389 by Miguel
Miguel replied the topic: GT3 concerns.
Jens Marquardt is making some very good points. But then again, the market itself should straighten GT3 out. There might come a time where GT3 goes back to tuner-build cars, but the formula itself should have enough safeguards to withstand the revolving door of manufacturers.

How is anyone going to police this anyway? It'll be hell to check every single bill and bankaccount of racing teams. And what would they do against a team such as Manthey Racing, that is owned by Porsche but operates as a fully independent GT3 customer team?

It's probably best to accept the shift that is happening right now: GT3 becomes a series for the manufacturers, GT4 for the customers. If series handle this well enough, those customer teams will still be around when GT3 reverts to customer-aimed cars.

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21 Jan 2018 08:57 - 21 Jan 2018 09:22 #10391 by porsche91722
porsche91722 replied the topic: GT3 concerns.
GT1 as a mainstream category is all but dead & buried.
GT2 is now LM GTE pro & am in WEC and GTLM pro in IMSA.
GT3 is FIA GT3 Blancpain, GT masters and a myriad of other worldwide series and yet is also GT Daytona in IMSA, plus some individual races add and subtract their own rules.
& GT3 cup Porsche's (and other one make series) just to throw another spanner in the works
Oh....& now we've got GT4!!!
At the B12hr, we've got class A, class B, class C and class I (invitational) for the Marcs.
What is it with motorsport, since time immemorial? Confuse the hell out of everybody to the degree that debate on the differences is strong even amongst most of their deadset, cast in stone fans!
And then of course, try to explain the differences of the prototype classes to a newbie to the sport........
By that stage. there's blood coming out of their ears, their eye's are starting to glaze over and you've lost them.
And this of course, is just in sports car racing.
Now...lets get started on the other categories in motorsport.................

"At the end of the day, endurance racing is the ultimate test for man and machine and that hasn’t changed a bit in the last 50 years" - Chris Amon
porsche91722.wordpress.com/
Last Edit: 21 Jan 2018 09:22 by porsche91722.

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21 Jan 2018 20:01 #10392 by Ryan Lee
Ryan Lee replied the topic: GT3 concerns.
I think the cost is a massive issue. But, i'm pretty sure i have said this on here before, but.

I think the thing that will kill off the category will be market relevance.

The easiest example of this is look at the Honda (Acura) NSX GT3. Put it next to the road going version and compare the two. They are so different from each other.

These kinds of supercars are created with ellaborate all wheel drive systems, electronic systems and driver aids, active aero and increasingly hybrid systems. none of this is allowed in GT3. Companies are investing sooo much money into advancing their cars to be better and stronger then all the others, only to have them "dumbed down" to fit into the category. Not to mention that some cars aren't even using the same engine that is in the road going version. ie. Mercedes are still using the 6.2L NA V8 from the SLS, not the biturbo variant in their current GTS etc. There are a few other examples of this too.

How much do you think McLaren and Ferrari etc like when they develop cars that on road will make some others look pretty stupid, but, on a track can be beaten by an "M6". You would think thats not the picture that these manufacturers want to put out. Oh yeah, you could buy our half million dollar car, or spend half the money and by something else, you'll get the same outcome speed wise.

Now, I'm well aware the people on here aren't numpty's, we're all well aware of whats going on. But, That bloke who wants a fast car with money, you know, the guy that is their actual customer, id say 6-7 times out of ten has no idea about motorsport.

I dont know, having people pay the bills is extremely important, it's probably why doing what we do in Aus GT has an element of success to it (lets not get into the actual happenings of the current state of affairs), there was a booming amount of people who were invested in the category, usually headed up by a bloke with some money and a passion for motorsport. Not factory teams throwing pros at us.

It's something that needs to be addressed sooner rather then later however, as i think in the next 5 years, GT3 will disappear.
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24 Jan 2018 14:40 - 24 Jan 2018 14:42 #10450 by StueyB83
StueyB83 replied the topic: GT3 concerns.
Merc uses the 6.2L engine to save on development time and costs of prepping the twin-turbo... then charges more money per unit for the AMG GT3 over the SLS :lol:

You would think the free market of GT3 would prevent costs spirals - because you shouldn't have to spend too much to have car X when car Y is cheaper but just as fast.

It's all the other BS that comes with the cars - engineering support, the need to use pro-drivers to win races. Being forced to used factory spares and being charged extortionate amounts.

It's become Pro centric and suddenly the factories are out there comparing d*ck size and throwing money to max out their programs.

Mech Eng. & Scribe for GT-Report.com

For deciding what to spray on your podium celebrations: champagnetipplers.wordpress.com/
Last Edit: 24 Jan 2018 14:42 by StueyB83.
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24 Jan 2018 15:02 #10451 by StueyB83
StueyB83 replied the topic: GT3 concerns.
The build of the cars have gone up too much over previous generations.. Essentially - you are pulling a road car chassis directly off the line and modding it - but the amount of mods is becoming too great. Being in engineering - i get that things like subframes and pick-up points for suspension are R&D'ed and optimised - but once you develop the kit of parts it should be easy to fabricate.

They need to curb the amount of cut-and-shut needed on the base chassis - because the race car shell becomes bespoke and too uncommon from the road car item. The manufacturers can then charge whatever the hell they want for factory parts - and it appears none are actually interested in undercutting each other for sales - its all a bit of a cash grab.

Carbon costs should be down - so body work shouldn't be as expensive as in the past. Of course, being manufacturer centric - SRO mandates the use of factory supplied body work - and each panel has an embedded RFID chip which is scanned at each event. Of course this is to prevent "tweaks" to the body work for aero advantage.

Of course, this then funnels customer teams into a position where they have to buy OEM and they are suitably charged for the privilege.

Repeat that over and over against other aspects of running the cars - and suddenly it gets hugely pricey..

Mech Eng. & Scribe for GT-Report.com

For deciding what to spray on your podium celebrations: champagnetipplers.wordpress.com/
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